Computers

Samurai · Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 11:47 pm Post subject:

Why LCD Monitors also tear.

The main reason why the refresh rate on an LCD may matter in gaming is because of VSync. The simple fact of the matter is that LCD monitors have to work on the basis of receiving new frames of information from a graphics card's frame buffer like a CRT would. So when VSync is disabled the graphics card will sometimes race ahead and when the LCD monitor indicates it is ready for a new frame during the blanking interval, the graphics card may provide a partially new frame overlapping an older one, just like it would for a CRT. An LCD monitor will then display this just the same way a CRT monitor would, resulting in visible tearing. The alternative of enabling VSync can resolve this.

Therefore LCD monitors, despite not actually physically working on the same basis as a CRT, wind up being bound by the same limitations and problems - minus the flicker - because they operate in a software environment originally designed with CRTs in mind.

I rest my case.

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PC gaming is not dying due to any console struggle in the gaming market. PC gaming is dying because of damned pirating. No publisher is willing to make PC exclusives for that sole reason.

EvolutionX · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 10:55 am Post subject:

Set it to a 75Hz refresh rate or higher. Problem solved.

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Samurai · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:03 pm Post subject:

My refresh rate is limited to 60KHz due to resolution and because I'm connected by DVI. DVI in most cases limits 60KHz to be maximum.

Not sure if we're still doing this. But
13 PAGER!

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PC gaming is not dying due to any console struggle in the gaming market. PC gaming is dying because of damned pirating. No publisher is willing to make PC exclusives for that sole reason.

EvolutionX · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:19 pm Post subject:

Use VGA then, thats what I use.

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Samurai · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:24 pm Post subject:

DVI supposedly gives better picture. Right now I'm connected HDMI to DVI converter cable. Besides, VSync fixes all tearing, AND no one's eye can tell the difference beyond 45fps. Maybe slight notice, but if you're paying attention to the game, you're not noticing. Nobody, no matter what anyone says, can tell the difference past 60fps. So why go beyond? With my SLI, I'm perfectly fine with VRam for triple buffering if need be.

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PC gaming is not dying due to any console struggle in the gaming market. PC gaming is dying because of damned pirating. No publisher is willing to make PC exclusives for that sole reason.

EvolutionX · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:26 pm Post subject:

I can tell the difference after 60FPS in Source.

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Leeroy162 · Member Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Posts: 294

13 pages r u serious?

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http://s1.gladiatus.us/game/c.php?uid=38986
gladiator game lolz ^^^

Blu. · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:18 pm Post subject:

If we added the 5 - 7 pages from the old forum. . . heh.

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Samurai · Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:36 pm Post subject:

Well there isn't an impact on how the game in played. I get better picture with DVI. And it can't be avoided on my part unless I want tearing. And if I got tearing, it would be pointless to have the hardly noticed extra 1000 frames being displayed per second.

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PC gaming is not dying due to any console struggle in the gaming market. PC gaming is dying because of damned pirating. No publisher is willing to make PC exclusives for that sole reason.

EvolutionX · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:55 pm Post subject:

Well, I have never had a good enough video card to see that happen, so I'll have to wait and see if it happens to me.

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Samurai · Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:41 am Post subject:

If I had a smaller monitor, and if I had a way to connect with with VGA, I would try the 75Hz refresh rate to see if it would fix it or not. I'm too lazy to drag in another LCD to my room.

Anyway, I wish I didn't always have to enable VSync, it would be nice for Crysis. And if you really don't know what tearing looks like. Its like horizontal bars pushing up and to one side at random points. The image is fighting to be displayed, and while in the process gets displaced and pushed off overlaying the full frame partially. Hard to explain, but annoying as heck to see. Especially for any FPS game. I'll play Bioshock without VSync and I'll see if I can get a screen. Never mind, if you wanted to see it, I suppose there is plenty of photos displaying it on the web.

Finally, the first actual service pack for Windows Vista is being released mid April through automatic updates. I'll tell you then EvoX, if they made any real changes. But from what I've heard, they are a few insignificant security fixes, and a couple of other unnoticeables. <- Not a word, but its my word, so back off. If I want to make it plural, let me.

I'm pretty happy right now, so the service pack better not screw me up. Don't know how it would. But I know how things that should help me usually wind up complicating the situation or slowing me down in the long run.

	EvolutionX wrote:
	Well, I have never had a good enough video card to see that happen, so I'll have to wait and see if it happens to me.

I didn't quite understand that comment. Sorry. I'm either tired, or I'm not following the whole conversation as I should.

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PC gaming is not dying due to any console struggle in the gaming market. PC gaming is dying because of damned pirating. No publisher is willing to make PC exclusives for that sole reason.

EvolutionX · Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:35 am Post subject:

I thought SP1 all ready came out.....

When I said I never had a good enough video card, I meant that I never had a video card good enough to produce tearing, where the video card is going faster than the refresh rate.

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Blu. · Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:00 pm Post subject:

My CRT is going down. And,

EVO AND SAM STOP YELLING AT EACH OTHER ABOUT MONITERS!!!!!

THEY DISPLAY YOUR GAME! THATS IT! GET 30+ FRAMES AND ITS SMOOTH ENOUGH!! IT DOSENT MATTER IF ITS A FAT CRT OR A SKINNY LCD! ITS A MONITER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good day bubbles men.

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EvolutionX · Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:03 pm Post subject:

Yeah.... but CRT's suck xD Talk about no desk space. Rolling Eyes

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Samurai · Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:08 pm Post subject:

CRT = No desk space. Often times blurry or fuzzy images. Headache inducing flickering(Even at very high refresh rates to me). And from 2 CRTs that I own, one cost like $300 other was like $140. Poor color display. Even my cheapest LCD of like $100 to buy, 15" has better contrast ratio. Though, I guess I didn't use software to fix the image. Energy eater. Space Heater. Glare from glass.

LCD = Hardly any desk space. Sharp image at native resolution. Good color, more vivid. Consumes hardly any energy, and run very cool. Only disadvantages of LCDs, depending on how much you're willing to spend and the brand/model is if it is a TN panel, you have to view it directly on or its too much contrast/too little contrast. Limited refresh rate, which only applies to games at this point, so not really a disadvantage.

Ghosting is no longer existent in LCD monitors. Pixel pitch from the TN panels isn't too bad.

LCD wins. Hands down.

_________________
PC gaming is not dying due to any console struggle in the gaming market. PC gaming is dying because of damned pirating. No publisher is willing to make PC exclusives for that sole reason.